The Bank Design I Submitted 1 Month Ago

[Vanilla Coke]

A couple months ago, Skimancole asked Fudger to redesign some fed events/make new domination maps. I like designing this kind of stuff, so this is what I came up with for the bank.

Full overview:

Closer shot from old first ATM:

Closer shot from the gas station:

Left side of the bank (facing from the front):

Overview of the back of the bank:

Back of the cluster of buildings on the right side of bank:

Closer shot of the back of bank:

Another angle of back of bank:

View inside from the drive-through ATM's:

View inside from the front of the bank:

 

Unrelated to the bank:

This is another design I was working on, maybe for a jewelry or something? There are only two van spots on either of the long-side walls. The top of the diesel power generators are accessible and have substantial cover for suppressive fire, but have no safe truly 'safe' position from all angles, and there are walk-over staircases on the left sides of each gate. I can't get the mission.sqf for this as of right now because I'm out of town, but this is a screenshot I took while I was working on it in late February. The location will not be bank peninsula, it's just a decently flat plane for building.

Feedback is welcome, if any dev's want to actually implement this design, message me somewhere and we can get it done.

[abdul karim azeem]

i get the need for a redesign, but idk if im being stupid but doesnt this heavily favour the people robbing the bank?
arent the atms in the current bank more of an item to combat the robbers on the roof
like in urs the only tactic for me is for cops to slam front door in a frit, the back is cluttered so itll be hard idk.

 

just tryna think of the bank from gameplay perspective, lmk what u think

[Austin M]

Yeah, this design would only get cops the option to full speed slam. The flat rock and meth houses are never really controller by rebels. But it gives needed cover. Any bank done if there is no corp+ is going to be an instant win.

[Vanilla Coke]

6 minutes ago, Austin M said:

Yeah, this design would only get cops the option to full speed slam. The flat rock and meth houses are never really controller by rebels. But it gives needed cover. 

15 minutes ago, abdul karim azeem said:

i get the need for a redesign, but idk if im being stupid but doesnt this heavily favour the people robbing the bank?
arent the atms in the current bank more of an item to combat the robbers on the roof
like in urs the only tactic for me is for cops to slam front door in a frit, the back is cluttered so itll be hard idk.

 

just tryna think of the bank from gameplay perspective, lmk what u think

That was pretty much the entire reason for the redesign. I don't think that many people enjoy that playstyle nor is it very effective. If you're playing like that, you're not really playing to stop the bank, but instead playing to pad your lethal k:d, which I don't think is very interactive or enjoyable for members of either side. I'm trying to discourage the sniper elite playstyle and encourage downing and restraining.

11 minutes ago, Austin M said:

Any bank done if there is no corp+ is going to be an instant win.

That is already true with the current bank design. It's probably even worse currently.

[Infamous [FULL SEND]]

imo move bank right outside pyrgos HQ, nobody fights it because im not tryna wait 5 min for cops to slam. That's why prison is so fun, it takes 30 seconds for cops to get to it. 

[Mako]

4 hours ago, Vanilla Coke said:

 

very wicked mr. Coke

[Good Lub]

8 hours ago, abdul karim azeem said:

i get the need for a redesign, but idk if im being stupid but doesnt this heavily favour the people robbing the bank?
arent the atms in the current bank more of an item to combat the robbers on the roof
like in urs the only tactic for me is for cops to slam front door in a frit, the back is cluttered so itll be hard idk.

 

just tryna think of the bank from gameplay perspective, lmk what u think

when did cops had a different strat?

Oh right,when they play sniper elite.

[abdul karim azeem]

4 hours ago, Good Lub said:

when did cops had a different strat?

Oh right,when they play sniper elite.

fr sniper elite gay, but what do u expect when most of the apd have 7 fingers total.

 

i think the only way i can see a bank being more fun for everyone is if it’s cut up into sections, where only say 3 robbers can be and the rest of the robbers can’t help but are further back. the apd push that and if they win they take and restrain or the robbers fall back to the section before. and obviously the further back ur pushed the closer u are to the bank.

think it’s just boring to be lethal ed by sniper elite and u need a design that promotes restraining and makes it possible for cops to do that

[Patato]

I don't think this is necessarily bad. 

To me the thing that makes the current bank successful is that it gives "Side" objectives to take and a clear set of buildings to fight for which will give cops an advantage when making the final push for the drill. (Or a clear set of buildings for civs to defend keeping cops from getting said advantage).

IE First > Unreachable > Lighthouse > Bank Proper.

I struggle to see how constables will effectively push this as they do not have access to armor. They will either choose to just slam bank floor proper (And die), if they are more cautious they may slam the market building. Once they get to the market building i don't really see where else they can go. They attempt to push the right side and it heavily exposes them to light house. Left side to bank. 

Finally in current bank first ATM at least gives equal footing for cops to shoot at rebels. Nothing in the proposed design except lighthouse lends you a shot at the roof (Making it a bit like jewelry). I know everyone hates sniper elite and we should incentivize APD to push, but making suicide pushes/armor dependency the only method of winning isnt great imo.  

(Keep in mind im of the minority opinion that believes cop armor should be special not willy nilly every fight, Id love to see the stupid captain APC tank deleted and cop armor made expensive)

[Vanilla Coke]

5 hours ago, Patato said:

To me the thing that makes the current bank successful is that it gives "Side" objectives to take and a clear set of buildings to fight for which will give cops an advantage when making the final push for the drill. (Or a clear set of buildings for civs to defend keeping cops from getting said advantage).

IE First > Unreachable > Lighthouse > Bank Proper.

Most of the time during a robbery, cops will take control of first instantly, because there's no point in playing there as a rebel. The cop on first will then proceed to be  useless the rest of the fight. Unreachable gets a bullet in the head every single time which is shit design, there shouldn't be a ladder-only position with a 100% lethal rate. Lighthouse is pretty underutilized; on one hand, it's, in my opinion, one of the best positions for attacking the current bank; on the other hand, most cops don't even touch it. I think incentivizing cops to go up there is a step in the right direction. If it is too oppressive in practice for a rebel to start the robbery from up there, adding an extra building which blocks the view from lighthouse towards the back of the side building is probably the balancing move. I'll address bank slamming in a bit.

6 hours ago, Patato said:

I struggle to see how constables will effectively push this as they do not have access to armor. They will either choose to just slam bank floor proper (And die), if they are more cautious they may slam the market building. Once they get to the market building i don't really see where else they can go. They attempt to push the right side and it heavily exposes them to light house. Left side to bank. 

I don't understand how this can even be of concern. Not only did they just promote ~10 constables -> corporal in the past 4 months, but constables can't win the current bank without access to armor. If there's no SWAT on against a group of 4-6+, you're fucked. Not only that, but I think that my bank actually makes it even more winnable for constables, with very clear and powerful attacking positions to take control of that apply real pressure on the defending party.

I also encourage you to think about the bank being pushed WITH armor and smoke. Especially when adjusting the design to make it doable without such tools and keeping it balanced for both factions. It is really, really hard to find a middle ground and I think this does it pretty well, or at least better than our current iteration. In the current iteration, there is 0 cover around the bank building itself. Even if you live in your hatchback, you can't even get to the point where you can foot push the bank because the roof sees literally everything around the bank building, and it's all open field to the bank/side building from cover in a 50m radius, even more in most spots.

6 hours ago, Patato said:

Finally in current bank first ATM at least gives equal footing for cops to shoot at rebels. Nothing in the proposed design except lighthouse lends you a shot at the roof (Making it a bit like jewelry). I know everyone hates sniper elite and we should incentivize APD to push, but making suicide pushes/armor dependency the only method of winning isnt great imo.  

I personally think first ATM is a huge noob trap and doesn't serve any purpose in the current bank. No rebel plays up there, the cop that inevitably ends up there never does anything. First ATM incentivizes a 2017 playstyle that people have adapted to and work around rather than contesting. Arma 3 is not a first-person shooter, you need to be ACTIVELY pressuring someone to peek/move or you won't make any progress. Even when people do peek, first ATM is just way too far and way too slow to capitalize on it. That position needs to be moved closer to apply any real pressure, but you can't do that without providing rebels with yet another bank roof to sit on, which is the entire reason for the redesign in the first place.

We're kind of at the point in this game with federal events where you need to play for the objective to force rebels to move out of super fortified positions, and I'm trying to incentivize that by adding positions closer to the bank with tighter angles that are more difficult to dislodge but super rewarding to control.

As of now, first ATM feels like an excuse of a position. It's braindead easy to take and provides no actual pressure on the objective. It doesn't even have a shot on the vault room. Especially in this design, with how weak the bank roof position will be when cops reach the back of the bank, first ATM just sucks.

 

TL;DR: I think the issue with the current bank is the outdated playstyle that the layout encourages, so I designed a bank with tighter-knit buildings that provide more powerful positions from rooftops that are accessible from multiple avenues on foot (no ladders except lighthouse). 

[Smokedd]

my boy cokes an arcatek now.