Change on group cap

[kryptonthegamer]

I belive cops need a slight cap as if lately. Id Say 18-20 regular slots. 18 regular cops and then you can have the precinct slots. Small gangs are not able to do any end game activities, which is fine. However, even if a gang all has money cap and 10 members, the APD is wrecking them lately due to their numbers. End game activities are supposed to be hard, but not so impossible. 

[Churu]

6 hours ago, Killswitch said:

No one ever sets up war weekends anymore and no one ever jumps servers to fight anymore. Even when there was no incentive to hold the cartels 6 months ago, people still did hop servers and set up war weekends to just try and have some good ol fashioned fights. 

Well... I believe with the money cap its difficult to do these fights because before you would save up maybe 30 million+ so you could come back a ton f*** times and fight for a whole weekend but today you can come back that many times before you run out of guns at the rebel and they become super expensive, sometimes a loadout can go up to 30k.

Still if you go 1 mil you can come back to a fight around 30 times to a cartel fight before you have wasted around 900k but counting for orcas being shot down, ifrits being suicided and 50. cals being chopped or other things the money can go well over 1 mil just after a couple of fights and instead of maybe fighting 30 times at a cartel you can only come back 15 times because you lost an ifrit and a orca, maybe a suicide vest here and there.

[kryptonthegamer]

Sorry,  let me pause our weekend war to go farm some meth Since I spent my money cap already! Well resume the war shortly. In like 5 hours. Ok cya soon other gang.

[Dork]

@hamsham12 @epTic

 

Where's the video? i got the popcorn

[Churu]

10 minutes ago, wr4thx said:

@hamsham12 @epTic

 

Where's the video? i got the popcorn

the forum war ended, lets leave it at that okey? before more shit starts coming up and before you know it

 

[kryptonthegamer]

I'm gonna put in my official thought: Up the group cap to 15!

[Dork]

9 minutes ago, 《New》 Krypton 《wəN》 said:

I'm gonna put in my official thought: Up the group cap to 15!

+1

When you have 10 people or less, its extremely frustrating to pull end game content off when you have 25+ cops on and a quarter of them are SGT+ with hunters, orcas, striders.

Add swat to the Chaos and lethals always being authorized, it causes even some of the best players to struggle at times. I've seen the best players being taken to jail because cops have 2 1/2 times the numbers that's their tactic to win (Numbers over skill).

Cops use the huge majority of numbers to have 8-10 cops zerg you in hatches and run around while the rest (10 or more) hard aim the shit out of you and pop shots every couple of seconds at your position. You can choose to spray the zerglings and have a chance to be lethal'd from a cop in a bush 600m out, or you can snipe back and have cops in your arse

Edited February 22, 2016 by wr4thx

[Mike Stmria]

3 hours ago, wr4thx said:

+1

When you have 10 people or less, its extremely frustrating to pull end game content off when you have 25+ cops on and a quarter of them are SGT+ with hunters, orcas, striders.

Add swat to the Chaos and lethals always being authorized, it causes even some of the best players to struggle at times. I've seen the best players being taken to jail because cops have 2 1/2 times the numbers that's their tactic to win (Numbers over skill).

Cops use the huge majority of numbers to have 8-10 cops zerg you in hatches and run around while the rest (10 or more) hard aim the shit out of you and pop shots every couple of seconds at your position. You can choose to spray the zerglings and have a chance to be lethal'd from a cop in a bush 600m out, or you can snipe back and have cops in your arse

You always have the option to leave. But yes maybe a group cap to 12-13 make it better.

[Sheriff Rick Grimes]

I play on server three, which always has a lot of cops.  Lately i've seen the numbers of cops online rise and does make activities harder of all kind, not just banks and PBs.  But also normal players trying to run drugs or do other illegal activities.  I don't really know what would be a good number, but a group cap should be looked into.

[Pentax]

On 2/21/2016 at 1:58 PM, Sheriff Rick Grimes said:

I think it's alright at ten.  If you want to use more people, you just have to use more coordination and communication. 

I think cops needs a group cap as well honestly. Having 10 in a group fighting 32 cops, for 2.30 hours with unlimited respawns from them, gets kind of old really quick. 

[Churu]

On 2/22/2016 at 0:29 AM, Pentax said:

I think cops needs a group cap as well honestly. Having 10 in a group fighting 32 cops, for 2.30 hours with unlimited respawns from them, gets kind of old really quick. 

a cap on cops at around 15-20 people would be ok for me, dont know about everyone else. Or increase group cap to 15 and cap cops at 25, cops should not be outnumbering rebels by than 10 people or it can get overwhelming. Rebels sure have a huge advantage in certain activities such as banks and PB(not fed's, fuck the fed its broken) and some times i can see quite a lot of cops responding and requesting backup to a PB/bank and it certainly gets very overwhelming, especially when you are 5-10 people doing the bank and suddenly 20 cops rush the back and front and the same time

Edited February 24, 2016 by Churu

[Mike Stmria]

Remember that the main goal of altis life is to make it look like IRL, or the closest they can. I'm pretty sure that if you try to rob a bank or do a Prisión Break police will greatly outnumber you, because their job is to keep the city in peace, they don't give a shit about if you want to live free for another day. Also if you are like 15 place those other 5 in spots where you know they will be (flying, office/government building) and make sure you din shoot them by keeping good comms. Its not that hard.

 

In the other side, yes a group cap should go up because sometimes like in cartels, you need to know who you are shooting to and most of the time you just react and don't see/ask in your comms.

[Pentax]

2 hours ago, TwinCities said:

Remember that the main goal of altis life is to make it look like IRL, or the closest they can. I'm pretty sure that if you try to rob a bank or do a Prisión Break police will greatly outnumber you, because their job is to keep the city in peace, they don't give a shit about if you want to live free for another day.

Then if we really aim to make it look more realistic, then we have to force 1 max 2 life rule for cops.

[Reformed epTic]

3 minutes ago, Pentax said:

Then if we really aim to make it look more realistic, then we have to force 1 max 2 life rule for cops.

Wat? 

If you robbed Fort Knox, you'd have thousands of officers/military personnel responding. 

If you robbed a large, national bank, you'd have hundreds, if not thousands of officers, FBI agents, and SWAT teams responding. 

In the peak times, you get maybe 20 cops...assuming 2 life rule, that's still only 40 officers. 

[kryptonthegamer]

6 minutes ago, Pentax said:

Then if we really aim to make it look more realistic, then we have to force 1 max 2 life rule for cops.

Well 10 armed men with assault rifles would bring in 50+ officers easily, swat teams, etc...probably a small military force even. So that too is unrealistic, maybe more balanced in terms of gameplay, but not realistic. 

[Pentax]

Just now, epTic said:

Wat? 

If you robbed Fort Knox, you'd have thousands of officers/military personnel responding. 

If you robbed a large, national bank, you'd have hundreds, if not thousands of officers, FBI agents, and SWAT teams responding. 

In the peak times, you get maybe 20 cops...assuming 2 life rule, that's still only 40 officers. 

This is a video game, not real life. If you want to make it look like real life, make a 1 life rule for everything simple. That's what I meant. 

[Reformed epTic]

Just now, Pentax said:

This is a video game, not real life. If you want to make it look like real life, make a 1 life rule for everything simple. That's what I meant. 

If you want to make it like real life, remove defibs. 

If I shoot you in the head, you're not fixing that in the field. 

If you want to make it a 1 life rule, expect more officers to start using lethals on a regular basis. 
 

I'm not going to risk my life, and my officers lives to down you and push up when we're being capped to one life. 

Edited February 24, 2016 by epTic

[Pentax]

Just now, epTic said:

If you want to make it like real life, remove defibs. 

If I shoot you in the head, you're not fixing that in the field. 

I don't want make it like real life. I was telling to the guy who thought that altis is focused more to being like it is IRL.

[Reformed epTic]

Just now, Pentax said:

I don't want make it like real life. I was telling to the guy who thought that altis is focused more to being like it is IRL.

People fail to realize that this is a SOFT rp server, this isn't fucking A3L. 

[LoadsOfMoney]

Pointless arguments being made the real issue is not the 10 man gang cap. In fact as rebels we wanted the lower cap to get rid of "Mega Gangs" however we were told cops would not get a cap but would be "split up" to assure the fact that both the smaller gangs and the previous large gangs now 10 cap hexed would be able to still do endgame and money making content. However in the current state of the game neither big gang nor small wants to do things like bank, pb, or fed unless you have that absolute boredom to fight for the sake of fighting. There however aren't that many who want to fight endless waves or 20+ cops on prime time just to sit in jail for 45 minutes. Yes you can say well you can leave PB or bank after you finish, which is true for the PB but for the bank if you want to actually make money you have to get the gold bars out which was a really bad implement to an absolutely imbalanced endgame cop v civ activity. Fed on the other hand is probably the most boring of all endgame activities besides the final chase in which both sides can't just sit in one spot tabbed out waiting for the other to peek, it needs a reduced time to do it or bring back towers to allow a more active play style I personally prefer the reduced time as I think feds are boring all together except the HEMMT chase. As far as cartel content well, the biggest thing is that having 2 turfs is worth more than owning arms which is odd as you would expect the 40% cost would be on arms not on two turfs considering its called the ARMS DEALER. If we want to make cartels worth more than you gotta start small by changing the fundamentals before we got free money and that was considered too "OP" by those who weren't mega gangs. Then we got gun discount which got nerfed into the ground, which was then baked into the turfs for some reason while still giving each turf an actual reason for being useful. All while leaving the arms dealer in a very useless state unless you owned two turfs already which means no one is fighting anyways. I'm sure if Paratus wanted to actually change cartels for the better while not being incredibly imbalanced he could have done a gang meeting to talk with him but that won't happen so the best we can do is make suggestion threads that go off into the wind. Back to gang cap keep as is redo cop cap to 17-20 cop slots 3-5 precinct slots seems reasonable to me, and actually split up the damn cops for crying out loud.

[Mike Stmria]

1 hour ago, Pentax said:

Then if we really aim to make it look more realistic, then we have to force 1 max 2 life rule for cops.

There is a 2 life rule in Server 2 for cops, but it doesn't applies For Fed/Bank/PB

[Poko]

On 2/21/2016 at 1:34 PM, Big Boss said:

Or we play The Division  

^   

preordered

 

I agree with krypton about a 12 cap for gangs, and maybe a 20 cap for cops just incase a ton of cops log on so that the gang doesn't get demolished. It's too hard to balance rebel v cop because you have gangs who are newer that try to do the bank/prison, and then you have elite gangs. If you make it balanced for the newer gangs, the elite gangs wipe the floor with cops. If you balance it for elite gangs (which seems like it's heading that way), then it get's too hard/frustrating for the small time gangs coming up. 

Considering it's just a server ran by admins, they've done a pretty good job so far with balance but It will never be perfect.

There's really no answer for it

Edited February 25, 2016 by Poko

[Gatorade]

On 2/22/2016 at 9:22 AM, HotWings said:

I see pretty much no issue with the gang cap as it is. Playing with Insanity there is hardly every a circumstance that flat out went potato because there was only 10 people marked, those instances were handled with communication, the issue of them not being in the group easy.  If someone died and could not be resed they left the group and the people there joined it. 

 

As far as cartels go... As Killswitch said, there is a whole lot of bitching and no real solutions.  People expect to get large amounts of money for holding them and that is never going to happen. You already get guns cheap as shit if you have arms and the turfs, drug dealers in the middle of nowhere with turfs. The point of cartels is to provide people a place to fight.  There is no reward for hot dropping on cops doing a traffic stop or at a drug field but rebels do that. You dont NEED a reason to fight cartels, you fight them for the perks there are and because you want to fight.

The guns are extreemly cheap when theres some on the market. With that being said no one makes guns because it takes massive amounts of time - causing mk18 even with arms to be 9.4k (Similar to cop mk1), and mk1 to cost 12.7k . Katiba usually has like 400 thank god so i can buy that for like 5.5.

I do agree with you that when the guns are on the market and you yhave turfs / cap it can go as low as 3.3 for an mk18. Id like to see a nice medium like 7.5 for mk18's withj arms, 9 for mk1, without mk18 = 10k and mk1 = 13. Just my  suggestion though (get rid of weapons on the market)

[Jonah]

2 hours ago, 《New》 Krypton 《wəN》 said:

Well 10 armed men with assault rifles would bring in 50+ officers easily, swat teams, etc...probably a small military force even. So that too is unrealistic, maybe more balanced in terms of gameplay, but not realistic. 

usually there is 20 cops and they come back 5 times each so basically there ARE 100 officers with swat teams lol

[Reformed epTic]

2 minutes ago, jonah1045 said:

usually there is 20 cops and they come back 5 times each so basically there ARE 100 officers with swat teams lol

I don't think you know what the word usually means. 

It's 8:30pm, 9 cops are on 1, 9 are on 2, 19 are on 3, and 9 are on 4. 

 

Edited February 25, 2016 by epTic

[Poko]

2 hours ago, LoadsOfMoney said:

Pointless arguments being made the real issue is not the 10 man gang cap. In fact as rebels we wanted the lower cap to get rid of "Mega Gangs" however we were told cops would not get a cap but would be "split up" to assure the fact that both the smaller gangs and the previous large gangs now 10 cap hexed would be able to still do endgame and money making content. However in the current state of the game neither big gang nor small wants to do things like bank, pb, or fed unless you have that absolute boredom to fight for the sake of fighting. There however aren't that many who want to fight endless waves or 20+ cops on prime time just to sit in jail for 45 minutes. Yes you can say well you can leave PB or bank after you finish, which is true for the PB but for the bank if you want to actually make money you have to get the gold bars out which was a really bad implement to an absolutely imbalanced endgame cop v civ activity. Fed on the other hand is probably the most boring of all endgame activities besides the final chase in which both sides can't just sit in one spot tabbed out waiting for the other to peek, it needs a reduced time to do it or bring back towers to allow a more active play style I personally prefer the reduced time as I think feds are boring all together except the HEMMT chase. As far as cartel content well, the biggest thing is that having 2 turfs is worth more than owning arms which is odd as you would expect the 40% cost would be on arms not on two turfs considering its called the ARMS DEALER. If we want to make cartels worth more than you gotta start small by changing the fundamentals before we got free money and that was considered too "OP" by those who weren't mega gangs. Then we got gun discount which got nerfed into the ground, which was then baked into the turfs for some reason while still giving each turf an actual reason for being useful. All while leaving the arms dealer in a very useless state unless you owned two turfs already which means no one is fighting anyways. I'm sure if Paratus wanted to actually change cartels for the better while not being incredibly imbalanced he could have done a gang meeting to talk with him but that won't happen so the best we can do is make suggestion threads that go off into the wind. Back to gang cap keep as is redo cop cap to 17-20 cop slots 3-5 precinct slots seems reasonable to me, and actually split up the damn cops for crying out loud.

This too ^ cops don't split up at all.

Make cop loadouts completely free and put a cap on how many times they can come back based on the cops on the server

I guess an example would be -- 

1-5: 5 or maybe even 6 because they won't be zerging 20 at once

6-12: 3

12-19: 2

20+: 1? Why do you honestly need more than one life with 20-30 people lol use a tiiiiiiiny bit of strategy and you'll win with ease

Cops shouldn't get too upset if they lose with that in place because loadouts are free

 

Edited February 25, 2016 by Poko

[bowly97]

+1

[kryptonthegamer]

20 minutes ago, jonah1045 said:

usually there is 20 cops and they come back 5 times each so basically there ARE 100 officers with swat teams lol

 

18 minutes ago, epTic said:

I don't think you know what the word usually means. 

It's 8:30pm, 9 cops are on 1, 9 are on 2, 19 are on 3, and 9 are on 4. 

 

Often

[Mike Stmria]

37 minutes ago, Poko said:

? Why do you honestly need more than one life with 20-30 people lol use a tiiiiiiiny bit of strategy and you'll win with ease

Cops shouldn't get too upset if they lose with that in place because loadouts are free

 

Maybe if rebels didn't play the peak fight at this situations this could apply, but since you just peak when you are going to shoot and only at that time, then tactics are pretty useless. We can go rush bank building and you will just wait for us to go into ladder room and camp them. We can have light house office building and if you don't peak we can not shoot you. Only thing to win is an orca drop and most of the time there are no Sgt + so we just have hummingbirds. So please, I really want to improve both sides expirience while fighting banks, give me some feedback on how to do it without an orca drop and with out you guys peaking.

[Poko]

5 minutes ago, TwinCities said:

Maybe if rebels didn't play the peak fight at this situations this could apply, but since you just peak when you are going to shoot and only at that time, then tactics are pretty useless. We can go rush bank building and you will just wait for us to go into ladder room and camp them. We can have light house office building and if you don't peak we can not shoot you. Only thing to win is an orca drop and most of the time there are no Sgt + so we just have hummingbirds. So please, I really want to improve both sides expirience while fighting banks, give me some feedback on how to do it without an orca drop and with out you guys peaking.

Well for starters, don't rush the bank one by one. Every single time cops rush together or in Sync with snipers they do very well. They get kills, and most of the time win. Do you want to win every fight? Should we go to jail for 45 minutes 90% of the time we try to do something? No

Maybe you should ask krypton for some tactics since he seems to get loads of kills yet the rest of you can't?

You also forget that we can play the peak game, but it all comes down to the end of it. You don't have to zerg lmfaoooooooo. PB - you can wait for the Evac and kill the rebels. Bank - Shoot the rotor out on the heli on top, or if it's on the back then get some snipers on East hills and have divers come up on the back of the bank. Fed - well that's a joke  

I don't understand the infamous zerg. The cops that are the most successful wait for rebels to move toward the heli or for perfect timing. What a surprise, those cops were actually really good rebels too!

Edited February 25, 2016 by Poko

[Mike Stmria]

24 minutes ago, Poko said:

Well for starters, don't rush the bank one by one. Every single time cops rush together or in Sync with snipers they do very well. They get kills, and most of the time win. Do you want to win every fight? Should we go to jail for 45 minutes 90% of the time we try to do something? No

Maybe you should ask krypton for some tactics since he seems to get loads of kills yet the rest of you can't?

You also forget that we can play the peak game, but it all comes down to the end of it. You don't have to zerg lmfaoooooooo. PB - you can wait for the Evac and kill the rebels. Bank - Shoot the rotor out on the heli on top, or if it's on the back then get some snipers on East hills and have divers come up on the back of the bank. Fed - well that's a joke  

I don't understand the infamous zerg. The cops that are the most successful wait for rebels to move toward the heli or for perfect timing. What a surprise, those cops were actually really good rebels too!

I do understand that neither side is going to win always, I'm just telling the cop side of what I've seen in my time playing. Also this depends te server were you play. But we went off the topic, so that's it, we can talk by pm if you want so this threads keeps on topic 

[Gatorade]

3 hours ago, epTic said:

I don't think you know what the word usually means. 

It's 8:30pm, 9 cops are on 1, 9 are on 2, 19 are on 3, and 9 are on 4. 

 

The second anything goes off the cops all flood that server so its never  realistic for numbers

[Reformed epTic]

7 hours ago, Sugarfoot said:

The second anything goes off the cops all flood that server so its never  realistic for numbers

There were banks on all 4 servers

[Gatorade]

8 hours ago, epTic said:

There were banks on all 4 servers

I mean I've had multiple cops tell me that whenever they see me / my gang on , they ask for backup , and I know for 100% fact when insanity plays i see backup on everyones name on that server

[Larry]

On 2/21/2016 at 0:07 PM, Addon said:

They're not leaving because of the group cap. a lot of the veteran members are leaving because gang life is dying. When gangs stopped getting real benefits from cartels is when the servers started to die. 

Server isn't dying tho.......

[DJScias]

Terrific to see the same people who wanted a gang cap now advocate for a removal or change of it again.

I suppose such is the endless cycle of "It's never good enough.", also to quote Larry.

4 hours ago, Larry said:

Server isn't dying tho.......

Numbers that we have on a dashboard show us we 800+ unique players per day in a steady amount (not in EU obviously, it's our downtime) and we can only hold 500 unique players with our servers. But most of those 800+ are generated by 1-4 and those can only hold 400 unique players.. Which means during our upper/peak times we, daily, generate about twice the amount we can handle which is also the reason you have to spam in sometimes during our peak hours.

Whether or not that's a few hundred more or less a few years ago, facts stand that the servers are still full during NA time when they were full back in 2014 and 2015. It won't matter much if we get more players if we can't accommodate for them so for all intents and purposes we're doing quite well and not dying.

Kind regards,
DJScias

[Larry]

1 minute ago, DJScias said:

Terrific to see the same people who wanted a gang cap now advocate for a removal or change of it again.

I suppose such is the endless cycle of "It's never good enough.", also to quite Larry.

Numbers that we have on a dashboard show us we 800+ unique players per day in a steady amount (not in EU obviously, it's our downtime) and we can only hold 500 unique players with our servers. But most of those 800+ are generated by 1-4 and those can only hold 400 unique players.. Which means during our upper/peak times we, daily, generate about twice the amount we can handle which is also the reason you have to spam in sometimes during our peak hours.

Whether or not that's a few hundred more or less a few years ago, facts stand that the servers are still full during NA time when they were full back in 2014 and 2015. It won't matter much if we get more players if we can't accommodate for them so for all intents and purposes we're doing quite well and not dying.

Kind regards,
DJScias

TLTR

vvvv

4 hours ago, Larry said:

Server isn't dying tho.......

 

[Whitey]

On 2/21/2016 at 11:07 AM, Addon said:

They're not leaving because of the group cap. a lot of the veteran members are leaving because gang life is dying. When gangs stopped getting real benefits from cartels is when the servers started to die. 

the truth of this is painful.

[Whitey]

On 2/22/2016 at 1:54 AM, epTic said:

look at the time.  durring prime times there are 25+ on it is not an irregular occasion

[Whitey]

On 2/22/2016 at 1:43 PM, wr4thx said:

+1

When you have 10 people or less, its extremely frustrating to pull end game content off when you have 25+ cops on and a quarter of them are SGT+ with hunters, orcas, striders.

Add swat to the Chaos and lethals always being authorized, it causes even some of the best players to struggle at times. I've seen the best players being taken to jail because cops have 2 1/2 times the numbers that's their tactic to win (Numbers over skill).

Cops use the huge majority of numbers to have 8-10 cops zerg you in hatches and run around while the rest (10 or more) hard aim the shit out of you and pop shots every couple of seconds at your position. You can choose to spray the zerglings and have a chance to be lethal'd from a cop in a bush 600m out, or you can snipe back and have cops in your arse

might actually make the fed doable for more people too